Is abiotic oil becoming mainstream..

[Questioning_Climate]

Strogoff, I never thought my rant would be described as a speech

I hope you don't mind a small continuation to my rant:

The oil industry is very competitive, much like any other really, and any advantage no matter how small it seems is taken very seriously. Even the idea that oil might be found in places other than conventional reservoirs is taken seriously no matter what is said on the public front.

Like most industry with large, very expensive equipment and a huge logistical inertia, exploration of any kind takes a long time to get off the ground. Exploration has to be funded and is extremely expensive. Some rigs cost $100,000's per day when all told. Some wells demand similar levels of outlay for a single data gathering run, and there may be several.

Investors don't like more risk than necessary and so if a conventional reservoir is readily accessible it is safer/more acceptable to go for that even though in the long run it will likely be less profitable than deep drilling to abiotic sources. Oil is business and short term interests/investments are the principle driver. Thus they go for the easy money first which is probably what most sane people would do too.

However, the oil industry employs some very smart people and they should not be under-estimated. All the major oil companies, and many smaller ones with new ideas and less inertia, are looking out a few more years, in medium to long term planning. The tide is turning to preferentially targeting deep fractured basement formations, i.e. abiotic hydrocarbons. It will take many years to become mainstream, but it will certainly happen. In the mean time the propaganda will continue.


SST, Derek and Richard111; some good links there, thanks.

Of course, the price of fuel (mainly transportation) in the UK and EU generally is not a reflection of oil price but the greed of government. Many would say it is a cynical taxation to ensure the population is well controlled.

[Richard111]

Q_C, good rant/speech whatever. Informative. thankyou.

One puzzle, how come the "smart people" in the oil industry don't push the abiotic origins of oil?

CO2 produced by burning oil is recycling the carbon sequestered in the oceans by phytoplanktons millions of years ago.

We are recovering the energy from that ancient sunlight and returing pristine carbon dioxide for the benefit of all life on the planet. [/align]

[Derek]

(09-13-2010 10:42 PM)Richard111 Wrote:  One puzzle, how come the "smart people" in the oil industry don't push the abiotic origins of oil?

Possibly because they are not politically nieve, in this area of the "science".

I am coming to the view that,
Politics, originally by "Royals", but more commonly now by "parliaments" and
(historically to a far greater degree) from religion have always, and always will rule the roost.
(Militaries also get in on the act - force is also a [transparent, and blunt] substitute for beliefs)
Science has merely been allowed, a few albeit temporary "victories" alone the way.

Science has always been, and always will be, a very poor second
(or third, maybe even fourth [behind the military] really),
to politics and religion, and by some considerable margin,
because of beliefs, whether they are political or religious beliefs.

Put simply humans prefer to believe rather than question, or to leave themselves open to questioning.
Many (almost all) view leaving yourself open to, or to accept questioning as a considerable and to be avoided "weakness".
This basic misconception, that allowing reasoning and / or questioning is a weakness is the nub of the problem for science, and us all.

This basic misconception is also the important difference between (scientific) discussion and (political / religious) debate.
Discussion is positive as far as trying to improve our understanding is concerned, debate is negative, aimed at quelling dissent, and / or "destroying" the "opposition".
But, which would you employ if you were to run a country, or to run a scam,
or, you have a politically correct / beneficial position, or career dependent upon you advocating what you (should) know to be a false paradigm.......

Maybe the "smart people" Richard111 mentions feel they are in the below sort of situation,
and they had better be very, very careful..

[strogoff]

(09-13-2010 02:51 PM)Questioning_Climate Wrote:  However, the oil industry employs some very smart people and they should not be under-estimated.

I wouldn´t dare, they´re talking about microleptons and fullerenes!! I also appreciate rants, or even reprimands when needed

I found a link to a group of companies using the "Microlepton GeoVision Technology":

http://www.alkor-group.ru/activity.htm

They seem to me smart people indeed. Please, click on the "Stock Exchange Technology" bottom link. I´m not sure if I´m understanding it at all. Is something there suggesting a futures market specific of abiogenic oil theory?

[Questioning_Climate]

Strogoff,

My impression of that website is that it is not wholly kosher. The page regarding setting up a new exchange does not seem explicitly related to the ‘micro-lepton’ technology.

I am aware of a few technologies that the Russians have developed that are not available, or that are implemented differently, elsewhere in the world. Some are very effective; others however are not.

Whether or not ‘micro-lepton’ technology/theory is legitimate remains to be seen.

[Richard111]

Don't quite know what to make of this. Found it on ICECAP. Is it a hoax?

What the Adminstration and Environmentalists Don’t Want YOU to Know

Quote:“This sizable find is now the highest-producing onshore oil field found in the past 56 years,” reports The Pittsburgh Post Gazette. It’s a formation known as the Williston Basin , but is more commonly referred to as the ‘Bakken.’ It stretches from Northern Montana, through North Dakota and into Canada. For years, U. S. oil exploration has been considered a dead end. Even the ‘Big Oil’ companies gave up searching for major oil wells decades ago. However, a recent technological breakthrough has opened up the Bakken’s massive reserves.... and we now have access of up to 500 billion barrels. And because this is light, sweet oil, those billions of barrels will cost Americans just $16 PER BARREL!

That’s enough crude to fully fuel the American economy for 2041 years straight. And if THAT didn’t throw you on the floor, then this next one should - because it’s from 2006!

U. S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World - Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006

Hidden 1,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world. It is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. On August 8, 2005 President Bush mandated its extraction. In three and a half years of high oil prices none has been extracted. With this motherload of oil why are we still fighting over off-shore drilling?
They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. Here are the official estimates:

- 8-times as much oil as Saudi Arabia

- 18-times as much oil as Iraq

- 21-times as much oil as Kuwait

- 22-times as much oil as Iran

- 500-times as much oil as Yemen

- and it’s all right here in the Western United States .

HOW can this BE? HOW can we NOT BE extracting this? Because the environmentalists and others have blocked all efforts to help America become independent of foreign oil! Again, we are letting a small group of people dictate our lives and our economy.....WHY?

---

Okay, maybe NOT a hoax!

3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana’s Bakken Formation—25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate—

Released: 4/10/2008 2:25:36 PM

Contact Information:
U.S. Department of the Interior, U.S. Geological Survey
Office of Communication
119 National Center
Reston, VA 20192

[Questioning_Climate]

Richard111,
Have you noticed that the media are not particularly interested in spreading the word that there have been several large new reservoirs 'discovered' in the last few years? It seems that other people have concluded this too, as is implied by this from the website to which you linked:

Quote:Energy » Bakken Formation

Why isn't this information concerning the Bakken Formation on front page news?

In April 2008, when the USGS released the assessment of undiscovered, technically recoverable oil and gas resources of the Bakken Formation, there was a press release http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1911 which was distributed to the media. The individual media organizations make the decision about what stories to publish. When the USGS assessment was released, news articles were done in several news avenues including the New York Times, the Associated Press, and Oil and Gas Journal.

For additional information go to: http://energy.cr.usgs.gov/oilgas/noga/ (choose Williston/Bakken in the map to see all available documents and links).

---

Here are a few examples from the last 7 days:
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?...a_id=98941

Lundin Strikes Oil Offshore Norway:

Quote:Production tests confirmed excellent reservoir characteristics with the well flowing at a restricted production rate approximately 5,000 barrels of oil per day (bopd) of good quality oil.

The Avaldsnes discovery is estimated to contain recoverable resources of 100 - 400 million barrels of oil equivalent (MMboe) within PL501. Additional appraisal wells will be required to fully delineate the structure and preliminary plans are to drill further wells in 2011.

At that restricted rate and assuming the top figure, the 'reservoir' would last around 220 years.

Then there was:
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?...a_id=98704

Quote:EnCore announced the result of testing operations on the Cladhan appraisal well, located in UK Northern North Sea Block 210/29a.

The well, 210/29a-4Z flowed at a stable rate of circa 5,903 bopd (barrels of oil per day) for over 13 hours through a 28/64 inch choke with a final wellhead pressure of 1,874 psi (pounds per square inch). The flow rate was restricted by the capacity of surface facilities and due to the small diameter of the testing tools and the 3.5 inch tubing used while testing. The Operator, Sterling Resources, has indicated that with larger 4.5 inch completion tubing, they estimate that the well is capable of producing over 15,000 bopd.

And a sample from the gas world:
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?a_id=98667

Quote:Russian gas producer OAO Gazprom (GAZP.RS) said Friday it has discovered a new gas field off the Sakhalin island in the country's Far East.

Gazprom plans exploration work over the next three years at the field, which is part of the Kirinsky block at the Sakhalin-3 project.

Reserves at the Sakhalin-3 project are estimated at 1.4 trillion cubic meters, of which 1 trillion are in the Kirinsky block.

Gazprom plans to start production from Kirinsky in 2014.

These are just a sample of one week and from only one media source.

[Sunsettommy]

(09-17-2010 08:58 AM)Richard111 Wrote:  Don't quite know what to make of this. Found it on ICECAP. Is it a hoax?

What the Adminstration and Environmentalists Don’t Want YOU to Know

Quote:“This sizable find is now the highest-producing onshore oil field found in the past 56 years,” reports The Pittsburgh Post Gazette. It’s a formation known as the Williston Basin , but is more commonly referred to as the ‘Bakken.’ It stretches from Northern Montana, through North Dakota and into Canada. For years, U. S. oil exploration has been considered a dead end. Even the ‘Big Oil’ companies gave up searching for major oil wells decades ago. However, a recent technological breakthrough has opened up the Bakken’s massive reserves.... and we now have access of up to 500 billion barrels. And because this is light, sweet oil, those billions of barrels will cost Americans just $16 PER BARREL!

That’s enough crude to fully fuel the American economy for 2041 years straight. And if THAT didn’t throw you on the floor, then this next one should - because it’s from 2006!

U. S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World - Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006

Hidden 1,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world. It is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. On August 8, 2005 President Bush mandated its extraction. In three and a half years of high oil prices none has been extracted. With this motherload of oil why are we still fighting over off-shore drilling?
They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. Here are the official estimates:

- 8-times as much oil as Saudi Arabia

- 18-times as much oil as Iraq

- 21-times as much oil as Kuwait

- 22-times as much oil as Iran

- 500-times as much oil as Yemen

- and it’s all right here in the Western United States .

HOW can this BE? HOW can we NOT BE extracting this? Because the environmentalists and others have blocked all efforts to help America become independent of foreign oil! Again, we are letting a small group of people dictate our lives and our economy.....WHY?

---

Okay, maybe NOT a hoax!

3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana’s Bakken Formation—25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate—

Released: 4/10/2008 2:25:36 PM

Contact Information:
U.S. Department of the Interior, U.S. Geological Survey
Office of Communication
119 National Center
Reston, VA 20192

It is real.

I read the original news release over two years ago.

[Richard111]

These finds, if published, should make the bottom drop out of the oil market.
But it hasn't! There is a massive fuel price hike expected here in the UK before christmas.

And they tell us there is no global conspiracy!!!

(edit: my initial reason for the post was oil under the Rockies; then the other implications hit me.)

[Sunsettommy]

(09-18-2010 12:19 AM)Richard111 Wrote:  These finds, if published, should make the bottom drop out of the oil market.
But it hasn't! There is a massive fuel price hike expected here in the UK before christmas.

And they tell us there is no global conspiracy!!!

(edit: my initial reason for the post was oil under the Rockies; then the other implications hit me.)

A lot of people know already.The ones who could make something of it,are adhering to the stupid anti CO2 paradigm.

[Questioning_Climate]

The only fossils in the 'fossil fuel' theory of the origins hydrocarbons are the fossils that continue to promote it.

[Richard111]

Personal thoughts on abiotic oil; Chicshulub (?) asteroid/comet must have cracked a lot of rock deep down in the Gulf. This must have allowed surface water to penetrate. From the Russian explanations it seem to imply water carries the needed hydrogen to the required depths. Apparently there are a lot of oil seeps in the Gulf that have been around for thousands of years before BP learned to drill holes in the seabed. Oil fields seem to coincide with intense geological activity.

Now the Pacific plate has been moving under the Rockies for many thousands of years -- hmm...

[Derek]

(09-18-2010 11:15 AM)Questioning_Climate Wrote:  The only fossils in the 'fossil fuel' theory of the origins hydrocarbons are the fossils that continue to promote it.

Here, here.

The politically ("scientifically" speaking) astute "fossils" that continue to promote it.

[Questioning_Climate]

Richard111,

Yes, there have been oil leaks in that area (GoM) for thousands/millions of years and obviously prior to the BP spill. They were seen from satellite long before the BP event. These seepages were the reason exploration took place in that area. Much/most of the oil never reaches the surface but is used-up by natural processes and some is probably converted to CO2 where aerobic processes are present.

The leaks are not unique to the GoM, but are found in many other places where fracturing and deep faulting occurs. Most rock formations are fractured/faulted to some extent, but the deep fractures/faults allow the passage of oil and gas from the hydrocarbon source towards the surface.

It is not yet clear whether water has to penetrate to these depths for oil/gas to form. There is debate as to whether water is being created in the mantle or was incorporated as the planet formed. Most likely it is a combination of both. Many planetary bodies in our solar system contain water and comets are known to contain large quantities.

Where does the majority of geological activity occur on earth? It occurs along the tectonic plate edges and they are nearly all in the oceans. Not just that, but virtually all rocks contain a certain amount of water. Large quantities of water are subducted into the mantle in these regions.

Thus water is most certainly plentiful where it is required and is continually replenished.